Mic alignment feature of Acourate

acourate2020
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Joined: 30 May 2020 03:59

Mic alignment feature of Acourate

Post by acourate2020 » 31 May 2020 15:35

Hi Uli.

If I am not able to move the sitting position and I am not able to move any of the 2 speakers, so I can't get PERFECT mic alignment for each speaker:

then if I skip the mic alignment, will Acourate still work effectively to correct for each speaker, even though each speaker is a different distance from the mic/listening position?

What are the technical performance disadvantages of skipping this mic alignment?

Thanks!
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UliBru
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Re: Mic alignment feature of Acourate

Post by UliBru » 01 Jun 2020 11:19

There is no real disadvantage by skipping the mic alignment. Indeed the mic alignment function has been created much later to assist setting up the speakers. So you can move the mic to the proper position but you can also place the mic at the desired position and move the speakers.

Without mic alignment Acourate simply records the speakers and also keeps the relationship of the volume. By applying a common target thus the correction will adjust the playback levels accordingly and balance the playback volume.

Acourate does not automatically adjust the absolute sound arrival time of speakers at different distances. It is possible to use the function 'Delay Measurement with Loopback' to get the delays of both speakers. Then you can correct for the relative delay by rotating a correction filter or by using the delay feature in AcourateConvolver. It is not mandatory to run a measurement, you can align the arrival time by ears. We are quite sensitive for this.
Stay well tuned
Uli

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Acourate system: JRiver/Roon -> AcourateConvolver -> miniDSP U-DIO8 -> TacT M/S2150 amps -> DIY horn speakers
acourate2020
Posts: 26
Joined: 30 May 2020 03:59

Re: Mic alignment feature of Acourate

Post by acourate2020 » 01 Jun 2020 11:24

UliBru wrote:
01 Jun 2020 11:19
There is no real disadvantage by skipping the mic alignment. Indeed the mic alignment function has been created much later to assist setting up the speakers. So you can move the mic to the proper position but you can also place the mic at the desired position and move the speakers.

Without mic alignment Acourate simply records the speakers and also keeps the relationship of the volume. By applying a common target thus the correction will adjust the playback levels accordingly and balance the playback volume.

Acourate does not automatically adjust the absolute sound arrival time of speakers at different distances. It is possible to use the function 'Delay Measurement with Loopback' to get the delays of both speakers. Then you can correct for the relative delay by rotating a correction filter or by using the delay feature in AcourateConvolver. It is not mandatory to run a measurement, you can align the arrival time by ears. We are quite sensitive for this.
Thanks Uli!
acourate2020
Posts: 26
Joined: 30 May 2020 03:59

Re: Mic alignment feature of Acourate

Post by acourate2020 » 04 Jun 2020 11:50

UliBru wrote:
01 Jun 2020 11:19
Acourate does not automatically adjust the absolute sound arrival time of speakers at different distances. It is possible to use the function 'Delay Measurement with Loopback' to get the delays of both speakers. Then you can correct for the relative delay by rotating a correction filter or by using the delay feature in AcourateConvolver. I
Hi Uli, regarding your quote above:

Can absolute sound arrival time of speakers at different distances also be achieved in Acourate, by fixing group delay measurements of left and right channels, by tuning excess phase correction (FDW window size)?

Or is fixing group delay something different to fixing absolute sound arrival time of speakers at different distances?
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UliBru
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Re: Mic alignment feature of Acourate

Post by UliBru » 04 Jun 2020 12:20

acourate2020 wrote:
04 Jun 2020 11:50
Or is fixing group delay something different to fixing absolute sound arrival time of speakers at different distances?
Fixing the group delay is valid for one speaker itself.
The arrival time of speakers can be different because of a different sound travel time. This can be of course also measured.
So you can e.g. measure two speakers with a mono sweep. The pulse response will show two peaks is the arrival time is different. You can measure the peak distance and compensate for it by delaying the quicker speaker.
Stay well tuned
Uli

Moderator
Acourate system: JRiver/Roon -> AcourateConvolver -> miniDSP U-DIO8 -> TacT M/S2150 amps -> DIY horn speakers
acourate2020
Posts: 26
Joined: 30 May 2020 03:59

Re: Mic alignment feature of Acourate

Post by acourate2020 » 04 Jun 2020 12:31

UliBru wrote:
04 Jun 2020 12:20
acourate2020 wrote:
04 Jun 2020 11:50
Or is fixing group delay something different to fixing absolute sound arrival time of speakers at different distances?
The arrival time of speakers can be different because of a different sound travel time. This can be of course also measured.
So you can e.g. measure two speakers with a mono sweep. The pulse response will show two peaks is the arrival time is different. You can measure the peak distance and compensate for it by delaying the quicker speaker.
Thanks Uli.

Once I have the distance between 2 peaks calculated, where exactly in the Acourate settings can I insert this compensation delay?
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UliBru
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Re: Mic alignment feature of Acourate

Post by UliBru » 04 Jun 2020 12:35

In macro4 you can enter an extra delay for a channel. Thus the correction filter will contain the desired delay.
Stay well tuned
Uli

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Acourate system: JRiver/Roon -> AcourateConvolver -> miniDSP U-DIO8 -> TacT M/S2150 amps -> DIY horn speakers
acourate2020
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Joined: 30 May 2020 03:59

Re: Mic alignment feature of Acourate

Post by acourate2020 » 04 Jun 2020 12:44

UliBru wrote:
04 Jun 2020 12:35
In macro4 you can enter an extra delay for a channel. Thus the correction filter will contain the desired delay.
Ah yes - thank you.

And to get the 2 peaks for calculating the time delay between left and right channel, you mentioned "measure two speakers with a mono sweep".

Can this be done in Acourate itself? If so, can you share steps?

Or does this need to be done with REW?
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UliBru
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Re: Mic alignment feature of Acourate

Post by UliBru » 04 Jun 2020 13:01

Simply run the logsweep recorder but select first mono in the channel selection combo. That's it.
Stay well tuned
Uli

Moderator
Acourate system: JRiver/Roon -> AcourateConvolver -> miniDSP U-DIO8 -> TacT M/S2150 amps -> DIY horn speakers
acourate2020
Posts: 26
Joined: 30 May 2020 03:59

Re: Mic alignment feature of Acourate

Post by acourate2020 » 04 Jun 2020 13:37

UliBru wrote:
04 Jun 2020 13:01
Simply run the logsweep recorder but select first mono in the channel selection combo. That's it.
Thanks again !
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